Madeline (00:01): Hello and welcome to SHE SOARS. Her Voice. Her Rights.

Amal (00:05): We are CARE Canada’s Youth Champions, a group of young people across Canada who are passionate advocates for Sexual and Reproductive Health and Rights (SRHR).

Lauren (00:13): We’re excited to discuss and raise awareness about young women’s rights and choices in Kenya, Uganda and Zambia.

Amal (00:20): Together, we will explore how these global issues connect to our lives as Canadian youth and discover ways in which we can all take action.

Lauren (00:27): We will also talk about the SHE SOARS* project, which improves access to health and education, which are areas we want to see change in.

Everyone (00:34): Join us!

Lauren (00:40): Hello everyone. Welcome back to the SHE SOARS podcast. We’ve made it to episode five and we have another really exciting guest to share with you all today. So today we are joined by Sithembile Sakala.

Sithembile (00:53): Hi. Sithembile Sakala is my name and I’m glad to be on this podcast.

Lauren (00:59): Sithembile is a Zambian based social worker with a passion for young people. She has 16 years of work experience with young people, women and communities to influence social and economic change. She has coordinated and managed different projects and programs that focus on Sexual and Reproductive Health, sexuality and life skills education. She is currently a Senior Program Coordinator at Restless Development, which is a global partner organization on the SHE SOARS project. So Sithembile, I’ll pass it over to you to maybe talk a bit more about yourself.

Sithembile (01:33): Yeah, thank you. And of course you’ve said most of it. I just want to add to say, I’ve actually worked in programming around Sexual and Reproductive Health for most of my career. And it’s something that I have passion about because I understand that young people, as they transition from childhood to adulthood, they face a number of challenges. Working with young people for me is something that just makes me proud. And it makes me fulfilled to say I’ve done something that can help someone or that can help a young person transition in a correct way to make decisions that are appropriate for their lives and be able to understand how certain decisions can have extreme consequences for the rest of their lives. So I’m very happy to work in such kind of settings. With me, I’ve actually worked with young people in different settings, rural and urban.

Sithembile (02:30): This is mostly in Zambia but I’ve interacted with other regions around Africa. So I’ve interacted with the southern region and worked with countries like Zimbabwe, South Africa and Lesotho on certain projects which were regional in nature. Currently I’m working with Restless Development under the SHE SOARS project. It’s a very interesting project and even the young people in the communities that we’re working with are actually excited about this project. So it has actually spiked excitement in young girls, especially young girls that are out of school, and it’s actually attracting other young girls who are in school because this particular project targets girls who are out of school.

Lauren (03:08): That’s awesome to hear about the excitement and everything. We’re excited to hear more about that.

Madeline (03:14): Yeah. And thank you so much for joining us again. It’s really great to have you here. Do you mind telling us a little bit about Restless Development as an organization and how you got involved with them?

Sithembile (03:26): So Restless Development is a youth-led organization. It’s a global agency. It’s in different countries across the world and its core business is young people. And we have this slogan, we say we are powered by young people and we are restless because young people are restless. We are only going to rest when young people are given an opportunity, a platform, when young people are actually taken seriously and are part of the development processes at all levels, when young people have an opportunity to actually be able to participate in leadership for their voices to be heard. Young people are not just beneficiaries but young people should be in the lead because they understand the challenges that they face and they have the better solutions to the challenges that they face. So Restless Development is working hard or is actually focused on ensuring that young people’s voices are heard.

Sithembile (04:21): Young people have the power in their hands as well. Young people are able to coexist with others in the development sector, even at the country level and all levels. So we are actually promoting youth leadership, youth-led development and youth-led change.

Amal (04:38): Thank you so much for talking a little bit about Restless Development. So you mentioned you did most of your work in Zambia. Could you give us an idea of what the typical sex education curriculum looks like in Zambia within schools?

Sithembile (04:53): Yeah. So the Zambian curriculum in terms of sex education, firstly it’s not called sex education, it’s called Comprehensive Sexuality Education (CSE). And this is being implemented in Zambian schools. It’s been integrated in the curriculum, the local curriculum that is being used in Zambia. So with the Comprehensive Sexual Education, the Ministry of Education developed the CSE framework, which had a number of themes that were being integrated in the school curriculum under the Ministry of Health.

Sithembile (05:22): So among the themes, they looked at relationships, values, attitude and skills, and then culture, society and human rights. And there was also human development, sexual behavior, and Sexual and Reproductive Health. So these themes were being taught from the fifth grade going all the way up to grade 12. Grade 12 is the last secondary school grade. So what happens is that the information that is being taught at different stages, it actually improves or there’s more information that is added as learners go to the second grade. So we have these themes across all the grades but then with different information, which is age appropriate. For example, where they’re talking about relationships, this is a general topic, so they look at family relationships, relationships with different kind of friends and partners, and then they expand it further like that.

Sithembile (06:19): So this is expanded as the learner goes to the second grade. And then they also briefly talk about culture and how it influences behavior. And then there’s also topics on gender. They also talk about Sexual and Reproductive Health, which is also talking about how young people can actually transition from being a child to an adult, how the body develops. And then also it goes further to talk about HIV and AIDS. They touch on issues around pregnancy, how can pregnancy be prevented and so on. So this framework or the Comprehensive Sexuality Education in Zambia is being challenged by a number of sectors in the society, especially the church because they feel like maybe calling it Comprehensive Sexuality Education is not the right term. So currently there are talks about revising this curriculum in schools.

Sithembile (07:19): So most of the stakeholders have come up to say, why should we call it Comprehensive Sexuality Education? Why can’t we call it health education? So it’s not called sex education. And now there are actually some controversies on why it is called Comprehensive Sexuality Education because some sectors of the society or stakeholders feel like maybe young people are being taught or encouraged to actually go and practice sex and so on. But you find that most of the young people in Zambian societies, they get information on sex from their friends. The majority of them, they get sex education from friends, the young people that they interact with. Of course, the school provides this but it may not be as in-depth as the young people need. But currently, this is what is happening in the education sector.

Lauren (08:09): Thanks so much for that answer. It really provides some context on what the education system is doing on this topic. So the question we have now is how does this differ for girls who might be out of school?

Sithembile (08:22): Yeah, so with the out-of-school girls and boys, the Ministry of Health is the one that is actually taking the lead on the out-of-school adolescent girls. But then you find that with the curriculum under the Ministry of Health, they look at similar issues, and then they also emphasize life skills. They also emphasize prevention of pregnancy. They also emphasize issues around decision-making, negotiation, planning for the future and so on. So this is taught mostly through the health facilities under the Ministry of Health. So you find that there’s a youth-friendly space in some health facilities at the community level and then there are young people that are trained to provide Sexual and Reproductive Health. They also go and have sessions with the young people in their communities. But this is something that has been a challenge because the young people that are at the health facilities, in terms of the youth-friendly spaces, there are not enough to meet the demand because we have a number of young people.

Sithembile (09:29): And then you find that in terms of human resource or the capacity of the facilitators, it’s not built for them to deliver adequate and efficient Comprehensive Sexuality Education or Sexual and Reproductive Health information to the young people in the community. So you find that the Ministry of Education also has Comprehensive Sexuality Education and the Ministry of Health has Sexual and Reproductive Health education. Also, they call it Comprehensive Sexuality Education, but it’s slightly different. And then also they look at issues around age. What do young people need at what particular age? So in the Ministry of Health curriculum, they talk about condoms and they also distribute condoms to young people that are reached, young people that are in the community. But under the Ministry of Education, they can talk about condoms, but they cannot go further by distributing. So it’s prohibited to even distribute condoms to young people under the Ministry of Education. But the Ministry of Health, they have programs where young people distribute condoms to further young people through the health facilities.

Madeline (10:32): Thanks so much. It’s really interesting to hear about the different ways that these sorts of educational programs or activities are happening. And it’s obviously, like you said, a challenge to reach girls who are out of school. Before we move on to the second part of the conversation where we’re going to be talking more specifically about the SHE SOARS project, we thought it might be nice to hear a little bit about your experiences. We started talking a few episodes ago about some of our personal experiences with sex education. So would you mind sharing a little bit about your experience with sex ed in Zambia and maybe if that played a role in motivating you to want to advocate for change within the system?

Sithembile (11:19): Yeah. So my personal experience for me being a young person living in Zambia, when I was growing up the district Chipata was not very developed but then it was still a town and I was at an urban school. So most of the time we never had sex education or Comprehensive Sexuality Education as it is now. So mostly if it’s something to do with sex education, we would hear it from our parents and our aunties. And then on a few occasions we would read books, maybe some leaflets and materials that would talk about Comprehensive Sexuality Education. But then at that particular time, it wasn’t that much because there were very few organizations also that would reach out to come and talk about issues around Sexual and Reproductive Health.

Sithembile (12:20): So we had a number of organizations as we transitioned to higher grades. We had some organizations that would come to talk about HIV and STI prevention. And then also an organization like PPAZ used to come to my school. And then we had an anti-AIDS club. So at that particular time, most of the focus was more on prevention of HIV and prevention of pregnancy. They would talk more about that because that was what was prevailing at that particular time. When I finished my secondary school, I started volunteering with different organizations that were targeting young people. I actually worked with some organizations that were also writing women’s magazines. So there was a women’s magazine and we would write stories and articles on HIV prevention and how women can actually participate.

Sithembile (13:20): And briefly for me, I started getting in-depth information and then I also got interested to say, okay, I think this Comprehensive Sexuality Education is something that young people need. Because it went further, not just often about sex, but it went further to help me reflect as a young person to say, how do I make decisions that are appropriate for my health, decisions that are appropriate for my life? And how can I also influence other young people to make decisions that will help them grow up happy and healthy in the communities where they stay? So I read a book back then, I think it was from South Africa, called ‘Life Skills Education.’ I don’t remember which organization had written them but they were being distributed. And it was so interesting for me.

Sithembile (14:11): So at that particular time, I was studying and I could also make sure that I was reading those materials. I was participating in youth activities with different organizations. We had some youth clubs that we joined at that particular time. And then I asked myself, what is it that I want to do? So for me, I felt a number of my friends ended up getting pregnant. And I felt, I think there’s something they lacked, the information they lacked on how best they could prevent pregnancy at the younger age. So there are a number of young girls who graduated at senior secondary school with babies. And for me, I wouldn’t blame them because there wasn’t so much access to services, access to information, because we couldn’t walk in as a young person in a health facility and say I want a condom.

Sithembile (15:00): At that particular time, it was something that would’ve been impossible and condoms were not easily found at that particular time. Full information was not very strong then. So for me, when I started volunteering with different organizations, I actually learned that sometimes young people did not know where to get this information. Not full information was given to young people for them to be able to know that I can go and access a condom, and then the availability of condoms or contraceptives was not that much at that particular time. So growing up like that, for me, it motivated me to say, okay, I want to do something different. I felt young people should know that of course when they have sex, there are certain consequences that come and there are certain things that they can do to prevent some of the consequences such as HIV and teenage pregnancies and so on.

Sithembile (15:55): And one time I saw an advert, a job advert that was requiring someone to apply for a project that was just starting in Eastern Province. And it was a sexuality and life skills education program. So I applied for that job and luckily I got it. Among some of the first things was to develop a Comprehensive Sexuality Education curriculum. And then we had developed these books called ‘Our Future.’ And these books had different information on Comprehensive Sexuality Education. I remember I participated in the content and then we had other young people that we had brought on board and the teachers also to just make sure that this curriculum was fit and this is what the young people wanted to learn. When we did that curriculum, my thoughts were like, I think this is something that young people needed, and I felt I could be part of the process.

Sithembile (16:47): That was a regional project because it was being implemented in Zimbabwe and Malawi as well as Zambia. So we worked so hard to make sure that curriculum went through the Ministry of Education. The Curriculum Development Center approved it and we started piloting. At the beginning, it faced a lot of resistance from the parents. They were like, okay, what are you teaching our children? You’re teaching our children to have sex and so on. So we had to actually make sure that we held stakeholder meetings to take the parents through their particular curriculum. And then in those particular areas where we’re piloting, it was easy because the parents understood the content of that particular curriculum. And I feel after that, for me, it was a turning point and I knew exactly what I wanted to do to make sure that young people also got this information at an age where it was not too late before they started making decisions that would bring consequences.

Sithembile (17:45): They should know that, okay, I can use a condom. I can actually abstain. I can actually make decisions not to have sex. I can choose who to have sex with. So all these things were topics that were being taught at the time when I started working under that particular project. And I remember also there was a book written by a lady from the UK who was key in that particular project. It was called ‘Choices.’ It was a very good book and most of the information actually helped for me to work with young people and helped me as an individual to make decisions about my sex life because it had in-depth information on what kind of information young people should get and where they can get the information and how they can make decisions and how they can be assertive enough not for people to take advantage of them and how they can communicate effectively. It talked about a different number of life skills. So for me growing up, I had that information as a young person and it actually helped me through to understand what sex education is.

Amal (18:59): Thank you so much for sharing. It just makes me think about my own education. At least in my school, there wasn’t much conversation about consent like you mentioned. It was more the biological aspect. But I think now mostly from what I’m seeing online and stuff, there’s a shift in the curriculum and starting to include conversations about consent. So that’s the end of episode five for today. Stay tuned for the next segment where we are going to continue this conversation with Sithembile to learn more about how the SHE SOARS project is providing sex education and addressing the gaps in Zambia as well as in the other partner countries of Kenya and Uganda. Thank you so much for joining us.

Sithembile (19:40): Thank you.

Lauren (19:41): Thank you Sithembile.

Madeline (19:43):  Thank you. Bye everyone.

Amal (19:46): Thanks for listening to SHE SOARS. If you liked this episode, please share it on social media, connect with us in the comments or give us a like.

Lauren (19:54): Make sure to catch our next episode by subscribing to our channel and following us wherever you get your podcasts.

Madeline (20:00): Follow @carecanada on Instagram for updates on our show and the project.

Lauren (20:05): SHE SOARS stands for Sexual and reproductive Health and Economic empowerment supporting Out-of-school Adolescent girls’ Rights and Skills in Kenya, Uganda and Zambia.

Madeline (20:15): The project is funded by Global Affairs Canada. Check out our global partner organizations:

Amal (20:20): Youth Coalition for Sexual and Reproductive Rights, the Center for Reproductive Rights and Restless Development for even more project updates.

Lauren (20:29): Thanks again for listening. Until next time!